Ivory-billed Woodpecker (formerly updates) (6 Viewers)

[bitterntwisted]

Oh, man, I hate to do this because I become another whingeing Brit full of armchair criticism and mean-spiritedness, but,....

TRE329's account contains the following: "As the bird sailed away from the tree she turned her head to look in my direction"

I'll be careful with my wording here, but I'm afraid this doesn't ring true. In my personal experience, the only birds I have seen turn their heads in flight are raptors scanning for prey. No other bird has ever turned its head in flight to look at me, and nor, in my understanding, could or would it. A woodpecker's eyes are on the side of its head, so it doesn't need to turn its head to look at you, either in flight or at any other time. Technically, it has largely cyclopean vision, with binocular vision in a small area in front, like a pigeon. I don't know if it also has a rearward binocular portion like, for example, a woodcock. A raptor, most notably an owl, has forward facing eyes since it uses binocular vision to hunt and hence does move its head. In short, woodpeckers don't turn to look at you.

I hope I'm wrong here, I readily confess to having zero experience of campephilus woodpeckers, and to being a relative novice UK birder. Could the many here with more experience please comment and hopefully defeat this point.

Thanks,
Graham

 

[TRE329]

salar I was just kidding with that

 

[TRE329]

bitterntwisted that is not to say she turn and locked me in her steely gaze(i mean come on)she turned her head slightly to the right side which I was on.

 

[TRE329]

I hope salar that you were being sarcastic when you said "gentle"

 

[TRE329]

Oh, man, I hate to do this because I become another whingeing Brit full of armchair criticism and mean-spiritedness, but,....

TRE329's account contains the following: "As the bird sailed away from the tree she turned her head to look in my direction"

I'll be careful with my wording here, but I'm afraid this doesn't ring true. In my personal experience, the only birds I have seen turn their heads in flight are raptors scanning for prey. No other bird has ever turned its head in flight to look at me, and nor, in my understanding, could or would it. A woodpecker's eyes are on the side of its head, so it doesn't need to turn its head to look at you, either in flight or at any other time. Technically, it has largely cyclopean vision, with binocular vision in a small area in front, like a pigeon. I don't know if it also has a rearward binocular portion like, for example, a woodcock. A raptor, most notably an owl, has forward facing eyes since it uses binocular vision to hunt and hence does move its head. In short, woodpeckers don't turn to look at you.

I hope I'm wrong here, I readily confess to having zero experience of campephilus woodpeckers, and to being a relative novice UK birder. Could the many here with more experience please comment and hopefully defeat this point.

Thanks,
Graham

By the way as to " No other bird has ever turned its head in flight to look at me, and nor, in my understanding, could or would" I cant count how many species of ducks have thoroughly look over me and my spread while duck hunting in flight pointedly checking me out.Puddle ducks and Divers are not birds of prey nor do I think were they looking for prey.

 

[bitterntwisted]

bitterntwisted that is not to say she turn and locked me in her steely gaze(i mean come on)she turned her head slightly to the right side which I was on.

OK, but I don't think I have seen a non-predatory bird do even that. As I understand how avian vision works, non-predatory birds keep their heads level, although on the ground they may bob them to help judge distance by giving a pseudo-binocular image. I do not recall and cannot readily imagine a woodpecker turning its head in flight. It's a wierd one - I mean it's not the kind of thing I have ever considered before, but whatever meaning was intended, the phrase struck a wrong chord with me. As I run through some mental images I reckon corvids and gulls may turn their heads but perhaps they are predators of sorts and have more extensive binocular vision. Whether campephilids do is way out of my league. As I say, I hope someone can make a counterpoint, but my conjecture is that non-predatory birds don't turn their heads in flight. I'll be out this weekend trying to prove myself wrong.

I hope this is still 'gentle'

All the best,
Graham

EDIT: Post crossed with the above. Will be watching the ducks too at the weekend.

 

[Russ Jones]

How about all the wasted man-years and millions of dollars spent looking for an extinct woodpecker? All on the back of a grainy video of a Pileated Woodie and the word of a few stringers with duff / no optics.

Had all those resources been channelled into conservation of the Hawaiian endemics, just think what could have been achieved...in this context, the last three years of "searching" for the IBWO do not represent a farce but a tragedy.

Alan

My only suggestion would be to start applying for funding to help out the hawaiian endemics. Let me know if you need help with your applications. I'd be interested in hearing how you make out.

Cheers,

Russ

 

[bitterntwisted]

My only suggestion would be to start applying for funding to help out the hawaiian endemics. Let me know if you need help with your applications. I'd be interested in hearing how you make out.

Cheers,

Russ

Don't think that really added to the "100 good posts" now, did it, Russ?... Be honest.

 

[salar53]

Inquisition

salar I was just kidding with that

I knew that, Tre.
I enjoy your posts - you're out there in the terrain while I'm merely in front of the computer.
And hey, you're like me; you can't draw, but your sketches are excellent, if you follow my drift.

Yip, "gentle questioning" is a phrase used , I believe, by another poster here. And I have seen grown men crack here under an innocent little query or two!

 

[Goatnose]

bitterntwisted that is not to say she turn and locked me in her steely gaze(i mean come on)she turned her head slightly to the right side which I was on.

TRE329 a snip from my search notes from May 2006, North unit White River Refuge
"I had stopped to look and listen over my left shoulder when from my right and crossing in front of me at about 20 yards a large woodpecker came flying across, not in escape speed but more in just normal flight speed, the bird had a red crest and was flying kind of arched with it’s head turned as to view back and get a good look at me as it flew, also at the same time it was...." so glad I made those notes ...good luck, keep searching...
Oh yea, I have to tell you this story...I took a layout blind out one morning and covered myself and blind with leaves and vegetation just 15 yards from a fresh scaled tree. A Pileated show up at about sunup to fed and I got some great photos. My vidio camera was outside the blind on a tripod and as I attemted to ease my hand outside the blind to turn on the video the bird saw the movement and flew down within about 10 feet of me to check out what the heck...after a couple of head turns gone in 3 seconds.

 

[TRE329]

TRE329 a snip from my search notes from May 2006, North unit White River Refuge
"I had stopped to look and listen over my left shoulder when from my right and crossing in front of me at about 20 yards a large woodpecker came flying across, not in escape speed but more in just normal flight speed, the bird had a red crest and was flying kind of arched with it’s head turned as to view back and get a good look at me as it flew, also at the same time it was...." so glad I made those notes ...good luck, keep searching...
Oh yea, I have to tell you this story...I took a layout blind out one morning and covered myself and blind with leaves and vegetation just 15 yards from a fresh scaled tree. A Pileated show up at about sunup to fed and I got some great photos. My vidio camera was outside the blind on a tripod and as I attemted to ease my hand outside the blind to turn on the video the bird saw the movement and flew down within about 10 feet of me to check out what the heck...after a couple of head turns gone in 3 seconds.

Hey Goatnose that last part sounds really sweeeet I may have to try that out in Wattensaw ,I have found some extremely recent scaling.

 

[Jane Turner]

TRE can I congratulate you on your note taking efforts. You've gone one better than most reports by maanaging to describe the underwing pattern. Good luck getting a better view of your bird in the near future.

 

[bkrownd]

that is not to say she turn and locked me in her steely gaze(i mean come on)

Do they have those "psycho eyes", like pileateds? Pileateds are a downright frightening creature - it's no coincidence that Woody Woodpecker's earliest incarnation was a raving lunatic.

 

[halftwo]

Oh, man, I hate to do this because I become another whingeing Brit full of armchair criticism and mean-spiritedness, but,....

TRE329's account contains the following: "As the bird sailed away from the tree she turned her head to look in my direction"

I'll be careful with my wording here, but I'm afraid this doesn't ring true. In my personal experience, the only birds I have seen turn their heads in flight are raptors scanning for prey. No other bird has ever turned its head in flight to look at me, and nor, in my understanding, could or would it. A woodpecker's eyes are on the side of its head, so it doesn't need to turn its head to look at you, either in flight or at any other time. Technically, it has largely cyclopean vision, with binocular vision in a small area in front, like a pigeon. I don't know if it also has a rearward binocular portion like, for example, a woodcock. A raptor, most notably an owl, has forward facing eyes since it uses binocular vision to hunt and hence does move its head. In short, woodpeckers don't turn to look at you.

I hope I'm wrong here, I readily confess to having zero experience of campephilus woodpeckers, and to being a relative novice UK birder. Could the many here with more experience please comment and hopefully defeat this point.

Thanks,
Graham

Hi Graham,
Birds do turn their heads to look at you though, even if they have you in sight. Its more obvious in perched birds, especially larger species, but I am sure I've seen them do it in flight too.
ATB
H

 

[Wildwood]

TRE329 a snip from my search notes from May 2006, North unit White River Refuge
"I had stopped to look and listen over my left shoulder when from my right and crossing in front of me at about 20 yards a large woodpecker came flying across, not in escape speed but more in just normal flight speed, the bird had a red crest and was flying kind of arched with it’s head turned as to view back and get a good look at me as it flew, also at the same time it was...." so glad I made those notes ...good luck, keep searching...
Oh yea, I have to tell you this story...I took a layout blind out one morning and covered myself and blind with leaves and vegetation just 15 yards from a fresh scaled tree. A Pileated show up at about sunup to fed and I got some great photos. My vidio camera was outside the blind on a tripod and as I attemted to ease my hand outside the blind to turn on the video the bird saw the movement and flew down within about 10 feet of me to check out what the heck...after a couple of head turns gone in 3 seconds.

Like it Goatnose!

Well there you have it! For the searchers out there, get yourself a IBWO glove-puppet and you're away...

 

[MMinNY]

TRE329's description seems highly credible to me. It obviously won't satisfy those who require a photo, and he did not note the bill color. But he has described unambiguous field marks. In addition, two details -- gliding and silent flight -- are inconsistent with most (but not all) descriptions of IBWO flight patterns. This suggests that the description was not cobbled together from a field guide and/or information that's widely circulated on the net. Finally, the turning of the head is the kind of vivid detail that gives his account the ring of truth. Even if, for the sake of argument, that part of description were the product of mistake, it wouldn't negate the other details he noted, since it pertains to movement not to the field marks observed.

 

[choupique1]

Oh, man, I hate to do this because I become another whingeing Brit full of armchair criticism and mean-spiritedness, but,....

TRE329's account contains the following: "As the bird sailed away from the tree she turned her head to look in my direction"

I'll be careful with my wording here, but I'm afraid this doesn't ring true. In my personal experience, the only birds I have seen turn their heads in flight are raptors scanning for prey. No other bird has ever turned its head in flight to look at me, and nor, in my understanding, could or would it. A woodpecker's eyes are on the side of its head, so it doesn't need to turn its head to look at you, either in flight or at any other time. Technically, it has largely cyclopean vision, with binocular vision in a small area in front, like a pigeon. I don't know if it also has a rearward binocular portion like, for example, a woodcock. A raptor, most notably an owl, has forward facing eyes since it uses binocular vision to hunt and hence does move its head. In short, woodpeckers don't turn to look at you.

I hope I'm wrong here, I readily confess to having zero experience of campephilus woodpeckers, and to being a relative novice UK birder. Could the many here with more experience please comment and hopefully defeat this point.

Thanks,
Graham

see ducks and geese turning their heads over the dekes all the time.....

and every turkey I have seen so far this season - has been turning it's head

 

[curunir]

see ducks and geese turning their heads over the dekes all the time.....

and every turkey I have seen so far this season - has been turning it's head

Would seem to be an easy thing to document.
Find any big woodpecker, scare it, take video, see if they turn their heads to take a peek while in flight.

 

[lewis20126]

Oh, man, I hate to do this because I become another whingeing Brit full of armchair criticism and mean-spiritedness, but,....

TRE329's account contains the following: "As the bird sailed away from the tree she turned her head to look in my direction"

I'll be careful with my wording here, but I'm afraid this doesn't ring true. In my personal experience, the only birds I have seen turn their heads in flight are raptors scanning for prey. No other bird has ever turned its head in flight to look at me, and nor, in my understanding, could or would it. A woodpecker's eyes are on the side of its head, so it doesn't need to turn its head to look at you, either in flight or at any other time. Technically, it has largely cyclopean vision, with binocular vision in a small area in front, like a pigeon. I don't know if it also has a rearward binocular portion like, for example, a woodcock. A raptor, most notably an owl, has forward facing eyes since it uses binocular vision to hunt and hence does move its head. In short, woodpeckers don't turn to look at you.

I hope I'm wrong here, I readily confess to having zero experience of campephilus woodpeckers, and to being a relative novice UK birder. Could the many here with more experience please comment and hopefully defeat this point.

Thanks,
Graham

Graham, I've seen quite a few woodie spp (including 7 Campephilus, 4 Dryocopus etc) and I cannot recollect any of them taking a sideways glance as they flew off the tree; of course generally they remain tapping away and allow great views. There are a few birds which do a bit of peering about in flight - red-throated diver springs to mind - but I think they are few in number.

Alan

 

[humminbird]

Close-minded or not, there are still no photographs of current, living IBWO. It's going to be tough to come up with a population estimate when you can't photograph a single bird. It's going to be tough to decide if conservation measures are working or wasting money if you can't accurately estimate the population.

Still not a reason to encourage birders to pull their subscriptions IMHO.