John, its kind of difficult to check or ask the dealer to look inside the bino with a light before purchasing,they might think your crazy, and i would do it myself but there hundreds of miles away.I thought i might get a good one eventually. I know leica is supposed to be the "rolex" but in this case it looks to be a "timex".I am not bashing leica, but for hundreds of my hard earned dollars the isides of a leica bino should be spotless.
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Leica Quality Control (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter mork
- Start date
mork said:
Mork,
I agree you should get a clean bin, especially one that is environmentally sealed. I have no personal knowledge of Leica's QC, but we should expect their finished product to be among the very best.
The only advice I can offer is general in nature. Porros are notorious for picking up debris, yet they seem to hold their image quality in spite of internal "pollution". Ideally, we'd all like perfection, but that always comes with a price most are unwilling to pay. Leica roofs are environmentally sealed and one would expect the sealing to be performed only after a thorough internal cleaning and inspection. In your case, and others, something was obviously overlooked. The question is: How does it affect the view?
I had a $350 roof with a flaw that was near the dead center of one ocular. A casual user would never have been bothered by it, but I was constantly irritated that I couldn't get a sharp image in one small area of the central image. Upon inspection and further testing, I discovered the problem and soon received a suitable replacement with no questions asked. If a flaw in their bin bothers anyone, they should certainly seek appropriate remedy. The no-fault repair/replacement warranties offered by many companies are a double edge sword for the manufacturers because, if they don't fix the bin to your satisfaction, you'll be receiving a replacement after your spouse "accidentally" drives over it. The economic reality is that it is often more profitable to build a product with predictable failure rates and simply absorb the cost of repairs. The Leica Lifetime Passport warranty is basically an insurance policy (and a marketing strategy) the consumer pays for when they purchase the bin.
How much debris can be tolerated in or on a bin is very personal. I don't clean my eyepieces that much because the view doesn't seem to be adversely affected by small amounts of dust and debris. Others will disagree.
In any case, a new bin should be clean and free of any obvious defects. As a result of your posts, my LED flashlight will be getting more use!
Best of luck to you.
John
John Traynor said:
I had a similar problem some years ago with one of the first original Zeiss Victories (I). It also got replaced without any hassles. And that little speck in the center really irritated only after you discovered it against a clear blue sky.
salty
geordie birder
i have been checking my leica optics while out in the field today and still cant find anything that is not perfect! - im very happy with my gear.
my leica trinovids, ultravids and APO 77 dont show any signs of dust or peeling coatings, so im pleased about that. it hasnt put me off buying leica optics, thats for sure.
but i do remember my other bino's from the past: cheaper makes like tasco, sunagor and praktica etc having little problems - wich you still shouldnt expect that EVEN on low end equipment.
my leica trinovids, ultravids and APO 77 dont show any signs of dust or peeling coatings, so im pleased about that. it hasnt put me off buying leica optics, thats for sure.
but i do remember my other bino's from the past: cheaper makes like tasco, sunagor and praktica etc having little problems - wich you still shouldnt expect that EVEN on low end equipment.
Mork actually they are not an authorized dealer. If you look at their website they proudly explain that they are a "Grey Market" dealer. They go on to say that their is no difference in dealing with them and an authorized dealer and that they will see to it that your equipment is warrantied. Who it is warrantied through I don't know. I just know it won't be a factory warranty.
ranburr
ranburr
Curtis Croulet
Well-known member
Adorama is listed as an authorized Leica dealer on www.leica-camera.com. However, some dealers sell both authorized and grey-market merchandise. My own view: I can't see spending $1K+ for top-line binoculars and then skimping on the last few bucks for full USA warranty coverage.
I own a pair of 8x20 Trinovids for 3 years and liked them so much I bought a pair of 10x50 Ultravids 6 months ago. Both are fantiastic. However, this thread made me paranoid about them having dirt on the inside. I checked by looking in with a flashlight, the only dirt that was revealed was the dirt on the outside surfaces. Great product.
Incidentally I aslo own a pait of Zeiss 10x40 and am equally happy with them.
Incidentally I aslo own a pait of Zeiss 10x40 and am equally happy with them.
Jeff Bouton
Well-known member
mork said:
Mork and all,
If you have a legitimate problem with your Leica products I'd be more than happy to talk to you about how we can rectify this. That said I have to admit I'm a bit skeptical. I think anyone who looks at your post history can see a very clear trend: you have only chimed in on optics posts in the month you've been aboard, and only when you have had the oportunity to take a cheap shot at either Zeiss, Leica, and/or Swarovski (in many threads more than one of these). You have not once added anything positive and in every instance you have added "Why not try the Leupold Goldrings?" A binocular that won't be released until June, making it very unlikely you are just another satisfied customer.
That said, I'd think if I were a Leupold executive, or stock holder, I'd be very concerned about a loose cannon out there protraying the company in such a petty light. Particularly when trying to establish a POSITIVE reputation in a new market. If the first opinion of Leupold is drawn from your belittling posts, then I dare say, many might be turned off and not even give this glass a shot, which would be shame for that company because I'm certain a lot of work and effort is going into this campaign. E.g. you draw more flies with sugar....
At any rate, if you don't work for the company, you are clearly a fan so again I suggest your posts are not helping Leupold's reputation which I know they are investing alot to establish right now. I would further suggest that if you spent more time enlightening folks on the positive features of the Goldrings (beyond an empty "..their great!..." ) rather than taking pot shots (whether an employee or fan) it would work more in your favor and be more useful for all of us who would love to know more about these gems. Again if you have a legitimate issue with Leica product feel free to contact me regarding this. I am a legitimate representative using my real name!
Sincerely,
Jeff Bouton
Leica Sport Optics, USA
matt green
Norfolkman gone walkabout
dear mr bouton would you like to take this oportunity to end this fad for ''leica baiting''and conform to all us forum members that there is no apparent problem with quality control ie lint,dust,paint trapped inside certain models,peeling lense coatings,problems with ''notchy focusing?''poor service etc.we genuinly want to here good things about the company that many[for good reason] rank as the best in the business. i was fortunate to own a pair of bn trinovids a couple of years back wich i considered to be flawless in every possible way,i miss them like crazy and every time i go into the field i cant help regret parting with them.matt
Jeff,i don't care who you are or your credentials,everyone has an opinion and mine is not very good with leica.I own a 10x50bn 2004 production and one of the internal lens is freckling.I would return to leica for repair but a friend of mine returned a 10x50ba for similar problems and leica returned the bino saying that was normal.Matt Green if you would like to see some internal lens freckling on the flawless leicas mine are for sale.Jeff Bouton said:Mork and all,
If you have a legitimate problem with your Leica products I'd be more than happy to talk to you about how we can rectify this. That said I have to admit I'm a bit skeptical. I think anyone who looks at your post history can see a very clear trend: you have only chimed in on optics posts in the month you've been aboard, and only when you have had the oportunity to take a cheap shot at either Zeiss, Leica, and/or Swarovski (in many threads more than one of these). You have not once added anything positive and in every instance you have added "Why not try the Leupold Goldrings?" A binocular that won't be released until June, making it very unlikely you are just another satisfied customer.
That said, I'd think if I were a Leupold executive, or stock holder, I'd be very concerned about a loose cannon out there protraying the company in such a petty light. Particularly when trying to establish a POSITIVE reputation in a new market. If the first opinion of Leupold is drawn from your belittling posts, then I dare say, many might be turned off and not even give this glass a shot, which would be shame for that company because I'm certain a lot of work and effort is going into this campaign. E.g. you draw more flies with sugar....
At any rate, if you don't work for the company, you are clearly a fan so again I suggest your posts are not helping Leupold's reputation which I know they are investing alot to establish right now. I would further suggest that if you spent more time enlightening folks on the positive features of the Goldrings (beyond an empty "..their great!..." ) rather than taking pot shots (whether an employee or fan) it would work more in your favor and be more useful for all of us who would love to know more about these gems. Again if you have a legitimate issue with Leica product feel free to contact me regarding this. I am a legitimate representative using my real name!
Sincerely,
Jeff Bouton
Leica Sport Optics, USA
dwalton said:
Actually, I think it's been rather instructive.
(1) The odds of one individual experiencing so many optical disasters with one brand is beyond my computational ability.
(2) If the same claims were made about another brand, there would surely be an uproar of unprecedented proportions.
And now, the rest of my story:
After reading this thread, I took a close look at my Ultravid and there's definitely something in there. Mostly it's black, but if I look closely I see a bright spot of red. The red comes and goes depending on the angle of the light and I suspect it's moving around. The other day, the red spot suddenly changed to a streak of yellow and I'm here to tell you that raised my blood pressure a few notches! The yellow flashed by rather quickly and then I saw what appeared to be dark spots all over the lens. I'm guessing it was some form of aberrant CA resulting from excess exposure to ozone or perhaps a rare occurrence of lens freckling, whatever that is.
My wife confirmed both observations and added "My that Pileated looks dashing and did you see that Yellow Shafted Flicker...he simply glows!" I immediately informed her that Leica did not deliver living birds with every binocular purchase! She disagreed. I asked her to prove it. She said, "Look". I countered with "OK, but I'm sure I saw that dreaded purple fringy thing more than once this week..." "Yes dear", she said, "that's a purple finch that's been here all winter." I could see the discussion was going nowhere so I smugly ended with "At least I’m better off than those folks who have rattle snakes in their bins!"
John
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