Looking for an 8x32 in the $300 range (1 Viewer)

[oberwerk]

Yes, they just do a few simple tests that you could do your self like checking the collimation and the focuser play and if they fail them they just replace the binocular. They can't actually repair the binocular like Swarovski, Leica or Zeiss can or totally refurbish it like they have done with some members older model binoculars. They don't have the capability because they don't have any replacement parts or the motivation to do it because the binocular is not worth refurbishing. It is just cheaper to replace it, because it is worth so little. The MIC knockoffs are just disposable binoculars and when they break you buy a new one or replace it.

Have you seen the post on our site about ROAMER (Ridiculously Over-engineered Accurate Measure of Eye Relief)? That piece of equipment obviously wasn't created to measure eye relief, it's our hinge-pin pusher (now doing double-duty). Why would we invest in something like that if we're not capable of rebuilding our binoculars? 24 years in business, we can fix anything we've ever sold (many are still in use). Now due to labor costs, it may not make sense to repair the lower-end models- hence our Lifetime Exchange Program. But certainly for the higher-end models, especially so our XL Series binocular telescopes, we almost always repair, not replace.

 

[Cest]

The most important test is whether or not you like the binocular. My best is a Maven and I paid good money for it, but it is a great binocular. I have several Oberwerks. I have used my 15x70 deluxe and 20x80 deluxe to see some wonderful dso's. They work great. If they didn't I am sure that Kevin would give excellent customer service. Are there better? Maybe, but these work for me. I gifted a pair of Oberwerk 6.5x32's to a child who utterly loves them. Frankly they are a fine binocular. The perfect should not be the enemy of the good. I took a Vortex 15x56 Diamondback out last night and had an enjoyable time. The views were stunning, especially in dark skies. My Kowa 6.5x32 is fun for scanning the sky and is useful for close views too. Just get what you like from a reputable dealer and enjoy it. Don't spend more then you want to spend. Don't fuss about whether "if only I had spent a few thousand more I could have had a Zeiss." I wish we made binoculars in the USA and not China, but that is not going to change for awhile.

 

[Alaska4me]

The most important test is whether or not you like the binocular. My best is a Maven and I paid good money for it, but it is a great binocular. I have several Oberwerks. I have used my 15x70 deluxe and 20x80 deluxe to see some wonderful dso's. They work great. If they didn't I am sure that Kevin would give excellent customer service. Are there better? Maybe, but these work for me. I gifted a pair of Oberwerk 6.5x32's to a child who utterly loves them. Frankly they are a fine binocular. The perfect should not be the enemy of the good. I took a Vortex 15x56 Diamondback out last night and had an enjoyable time. The views were stunning, especially in dark skies. My Kowa 6.5x32 is fun for scanning the sky and is useful for close views too. Just get what you like from a reputable dealer and enjoy it. Don't spend more then you want to spend. Don't fuss about whether "if only I had spent a few thousand more I could have had a Zeiss." I wish we made binoculars in the USA and not China, but that is not going to change for awhile.

Solid post, solid thoughts

 

[Zedster]

The most important test is whether or not you like the binocular. My best is a Maven and I paid good money for it, but it is a great binocular. I have several Oberwerks. I have used my 15x70 deluxe and 20x80 deluxe to see some wonderful dso's. They work great. If they didn't I am sure that Kevin would give excellent customer service. Are there better? Maybe, but these work for me. I gifted a pair of Oberwerk 6.5x32's to a child who utterly loves them. Frankly they are a fine binocular. The perfect should not be the enemy of the good. I took a Vortex 15x56 Diamondback out last night and had an enjoyable time. The views were stunning, especially in dark skies. My Kowa 6.5x32 is fun for scanning the sky and is useful for close views too. Just get what you like from a reputable dealer and enjoy it. Don't spend more then you want to spend. Don't fuss about whether "if only I had spent a few thousand more I could have had a Zeiss." I wish we made binoculars in the USA and not China, but that is not going to change for awhile.

YOU WIN THE INTERNET! Best post ever.

 

[Zedster]

"What you're paying for is lots and lots and lots of inspections and tests. And a lot of rejections."

Yes, but that is the difference between the MIC and the MIJ and MIE binoculars. With the MIC binoculars, the buyer becomes the quality control inspector. Maybe that is the difference between Swarovski and Zeiss quality. The Swarovski manufacturing process looks like a clean room, and they use microscopes according to the videos I have seen of their manufacturing and coating processes.

Nice video, but not only is that NOT a clean room I wouldn't allow my manufacturing environment to look like that. There is FOD on the work benches, the tools are not shadow boxed and they aren't using torque wrenches. This is pretty typical for what I've seen. I would give them a list of "requests" for improvements if I were auditing them. Plus I would write them a finding for not using torque wrenches. Now admittedly I am using Aerospace standards in my auditing processes but the opportunity for FOD in this process is really high. Since we are talking about high end optics any FOD could be very detrimental to performance.

 

[Zedster]

Have you seen the post on our site about ROAMER (Ridiculously Over-engineered Accurate Measure of Eye Relief)? That piece of equipment obviously wasn't created to measure eye relief, it's our hinge-pin pusher (now doing double-duty). Why would we invest in something like that if we're not capable of rebuilding our binoculars? 24 years in business, we can fix anything we've ever sold (many are still in use). Now due to labor costs, it may not make sense to repair the lower-end models- hence our Lifetime Exchange Program. But certainly for the higher-end models, especially so our XL Series binocular telescopes, we almost always repair, not replace.

Thanks for chiming in on the repair vs replace decision process. It's always good to hear a manufacturer's perspective.

 

[Maljunulo]

I wonder if any of you have ever even been in an optics house because the level of BS here is unbelievable. You can't make optics without knowledgeable technicians. You can't align optics without specialized equipment and some amount of know-how. Here's the thing, it's ALWAYS a cost/benefit analysis when a RMA comes in. Can I repair these for less than a new one costs to build? That depends on a LOT of variables and one of those is sunk cost. So the MIC pair of Opticrons likely has a 50-100 dollar markup while the NLs it's probably more like 1-1.5 THOUSAND dollars. So a repair is a lot more feasible in that instance. With the cheaper pair it may well cost you more to repair them than replace them. Binoculars are complicated and incredibly cheap for what they are. Even those NLs are dirt cheap compared to the 30-60k we were paying for lens assemblies. Even then I had some rejected ones replaced.

And stop it with the whole "MIJ and MIE are so great" thing, I've SEEN Zeiss manufacturing. It's stone age compared to what it should be. If you REALLY want the best they need to be made in a clean room and inspected under microscopes. They aren't. What you're paying for is lots and lots and lots of inspections and tests. And a whole lot of rejections. Man the crappy manufacturing I've witnessed would make you swear off ever buying anything again. Some of the Allbinos transmission curves make me wonder if their coating houses know what they're doing.

This is, to me, a very interesting post.

(it starts out with a bit of an understatement, though)

 

[dries1]

I found it extremely subjective and opinionated, but then again much of the info here is.

 

[Foss]

Why would we invest in something like that if we're not capable of rebuilding our binoculars? 24 years in business, we can fix anything we've ever sold (many are still in use).

A few years back, Kevin even flew out to San Diego to pick up an extra collimator, a US Navy Mk IV, as an addition to the collimator he already had.
If you buy a binocular from Oberwerk, and a little slip of paper falls out of the box that says it was personally inspected by Kevin Busarow, rest assured, it was.

 

[[email protected]]

The most important test is whether or not you like the binocular. My best is a Maven and I paid good money for it, but it is a great binocular. I have several Oberwerks. I have used my 15x70 deluxe and 20x80 deluxe to see some wonderful dso's. They work great. If they didn't I am sure that Kevin would give excellent customer service. Are there better? Maybe, but these work for me. I gifted a pair of Oberwerk 6.5x32's to a child who utterly loves them. Frankly they are a fine binocular. The perfect should not be the enemy of the good. I took a Vortex 15x56 Diamondback out last night and had an enjoyable time. The views were stunning, especially in dark skies. My Kowa 6.5x32 is fun for scanning the sky and is useful for close views too. Just get what you like from a reputable dealer and enjoy it. Don't spend more then you want to spend. Don't fuss about whether "if only I had spent a few thousand more I could have had a Zeiss." I wish we made binoculars in the USA and not China, but that is not going to change for awhile.

My point is, will the binocular stand the test of time? Regardless of what you say, the better quality Zeiss, Leica, Nikon and Swarovski binoculars are going to last longer and be more repairable over the years than the MIC binoculars. When was the last time you heard of somebody sending a MIC binocular like the Oberwerk or Kowa back to the factory, and they totally refurbished it for free like Swarovski does all the time. The MIE and MIJ binoculars are higher quality initially, and they will last longer than a MIC binocular, and that is a fact. You get what you pay for.

 

[thelouisianabirdnerd]

I've been reading a number of reviews (and posts here), looking for an affordable 8x32 binocular that is better than the Prostaff 7s I currently have. The Prostaffs are sharp and light weight but reflections are an issue and it would be nice to have a wider FOV. Ideally, I'm looking for binoculars that are sharp across the view with good color and decent CA control. Good control of glare, too. Comfortable to handle, with a reliable build and warranty. It's been a challenge to find a highly rated model with ED glass for $300 or so. So I'm hoping some birders here might have recommendations? Thanks!

I currently use vortex diamondbacks 8x32 as my daily bin, and I love them!

 

[[email protected]]

Have you seen the post on our site about ROAMER (Ridiculously Over-engineered Accurate Measure of Eye Relief)? That piece of equipment obviously wasn't created to measure eye relief, it's our hinge-pin pusher (now doing double-duty). Why would we invest in something like that if we're not capable of rebuilding our binoculars? 24 years in business, we can fix anything we've ever sold (many are still in use). Now due to labor costs, it may not make sense to repair the lower-end models- hence our Lifetime Exchange Program. But certainly for the higher-end models, especially so our XL Series binocular telescopes, we almost always repair, not replace.

Yes, but your XL Series binocular telescopes are big aperture binoculars intended for the astronomy market that retail for $2 to $5K. Of course, you would repair those. They are not really intended for the birding market. What about your Oberwerk SE 8x32. Do you repair or replace them ?

 

[[email protected]]

I currently use vortex diamondbacks 8x32 as my daily bin, and I love them!

Yes, the MIC binoculars do have pretty good optics, but will they hold up down the road like a Swarovski, Zeiss or Leica? My point is if you buy a Vortex Diamondback for $300, and you buy a Leica Trinovid for $800 and the Leica lasts 5 times as long, which one was a better buy?

 

[oberwerk]

Yes, but your XL Series binocular telescopes are big aperture binoculars intended for the astronomy market that retail for $2 to $5K. Of course, you repair those. They are not what we are talking about here, and surely not intended for the birding market. We are talking about your Oberwerk SE 8x32. Do you repair them with your pin pusher?

Like I said, we can repair anything we sell. A good condition $250+ binocular? Sure, repairing would make sense. A 12-year-old sub-$250 binocular? We could, but you'd probably be better off replacing. BTW, repairs are rarely because something wore out, they're almost always due to a hard drop.

 

[dries1]

Winginit,

Getting back to the tread, there are many 8X32s to choose from, so let us know how your choice goes.

 

[Ted Y.]

So if I sent my 10-year-old Oberwerk SE 8x32 in for repair, you could totally refurbish it like Leica does for no cost or would you just replace it?

Whew you buy a Leica binocular, you pay for Leica quality optics AND

totally refurbish it

This activities are not free of charge. Nor is the 30 years warranty.
Other brands can do business differently. And the clients seem happy with it.

 

[dries1]

I sure hope the new Zeiss SFL 8 and 10X30 comes out soon, because we are really reaching these days for something to talk about.

 

[stevenberk]

Yes, the MIC binoculars do have pretty good optics, but will they hold up down the road like a Swarovski, Zeiss or Leica? My point is if you buy a Vortex Diamondback for $300, and you buy a Leica Trinovid for $800 and the Leica lasts 5 times as long, which one was a better buy?

I hope I live long enough to find out.

 

[Cest]

My point is, will the binocular stand the test of time? Regardless of what you say, the better quality Zeiss, Leica, Nikon and Swarovski binoculars are going to last longer and be more repairable over the years than the MIC binoculars. When was the last time you heard of somebody sending a MIC binocular like the Oberwerk or Kowa back to the factory, and they totally refurbished it for free like Swarovski does all the time. The MIE and MIJ binoculars are higher quality initially, and they will last longer than a MIC binocular, and that is a fact. You get what you pay for.

The OP asked about a $300 binocular. Not everyone drives a 100k car. I drive a Honda Accord and it’s great. If you take care of a binocular it can last a long time. People still use ones made decades ago that are not alphas. Why do you find it necessary to be contentious? Sell me a new Zeiss Victory for $300, otherwise stop being so difficult. Just say what $300 binocular fits the OP’s question. It isn’t rocket science.

 

[Maljunulo]

Just say what $300 binocular fits the OP’s question. It isn’t rocket science.

Since every price range has common characteristics, it strikes me that there is not a single answer to the question.

I think that has been rather clearly demonstrated.