New Swarovski EL (1 Viewer)

[BertL]

Are you able to compare the new one with the previous FP , side by side? Or are you going by memory ?

You say , they’re not as flat, are you saying they have more Curvature at the edges, like the SLC’s? And when you say softer, are saying a warmer, more yellow color rendition?

These things are not what I buy EL’s for, those are the things I buy an SLC , or with those personalities, that’s why I buy Leica. I don’t want to pay EL prices for a SLC.
thx

Paul

I have had the previous and new version quite short after eachother. It was the different but excelent view that made me look inside the tubes.
It is not an SLC, but it is an excellent binocular, a real masterpiece!
It is worth every penny I paid for it. It is cheap when you compare it to a Leica.
But as I said before, binoculars are very personal. Each binocular has his own weakness, but these fit my needs.
Because of my work I use a binocular almost every day for several hours, often very early in the morning or late in the afternoon, early evening. They are excellent under these conditions. Beautifull colors, contrast and detail. Transparant 3D view. Great DOF. And 60 degr. AFOV is sufficient for me.
The previous EL had 3,3 m close focus. I measured 2,6 m on the new one.

 

[Paultricounty]

I have had the previous and new version quite short after eachother. It was the different but excelent view that made me look inside the tubes.
It is not an SLC, but it is an excellent binocular, a real masterpiece!
It is worth every penny I paid for it. It is cheap when you compare it to a Leica.
But as I said before, binoculars are very personal. Each binocular has his own weakness, but these fit my needs.
Because of my work I use a binocular almost every day for several hours, often very early in the morning or late in the afternoon, early evening. They are excellent under these conditions. Beautifull colors, contrast and detail. Transparant 3D view. Great DOF. And 60 degr. AFOV is sufficient for me.
The previous EL had 3,3 m close focus. I measured 2,6 m on the new one.

I fully get you like them and they are excellent, and you like them better and feel they are a better value than a Leica, but that is all personal (as you stated) and very subjective. Maybe you didn't understand me or I wasn't being to clear. I was hoping you could discuss the actual optical differences between what you say are new EL's in comparison to the previous FP SV one you have or had.

If you saying internals are the same as an SLC, I'm curious why and to what effect that had on the image. I happen to really like the flat field and neutral color rendition on my EL's and thats the selling point for me. If your saying those two things have changed, whether you like them better, is not explaining the difference, if you know what I mean?

I have many other binoculars that have that softer/warmer and immersive image. Im not worried about AFOV with any EL's , so thats a non issue for me and same with close focus. DOF should be the same in all of them if the magnification is the same, thats a product mostly of magnification, not a slight difference in design.

Paul

 

[Dr. K]

I tried to take a picture in my EL 8.5x42 (pre-close focus increase), but it was very hard to get any light to reflect.

I brought out the flashlight… images of EL 8.5x42, EL 8x32, NL 8x32, and CL(B) 8x30…

 

[BertL]

I tried to take a picture in my EL 8.5x42 (pre-close focus increase), but it was very hard to get any light to reflect.

I brought out the flashlight… images of EL 8.5x42, EL 8x32, NL 8x32, and CL(B) 8x30…

View attachment 1471907

View attachment 1471908
View attachment 1471910
View attachment 1471911

Nice collection!!! I had them all except the CL.

I AM AN EYEGLAS WEARER!

When you compare the first picture of the 8,5 with my picture the differences are obvious!! The base of the prism and sleeve of the focusing lens are completely different .

As you have both the EL and the NL, both 8x32, the viewing differences betreden the two is almost identical to the differences between the old and new EL 8.5X42.

The performance of the EL and NL 8X32 against bright light, like low sun as you have in the early morning is for me unacceptable. I switched to the Leica Noctivid for that reason. The problem I have with the Noctivid is that the image is to dark for me.

The new EL has a performance comming very close to the Noctivid, but with brighter image. I also like the colors and contrast better. The Noctivid wins with extreme sharpness and perfect close focus. Although I think the coating is creating the feel of sharpness as in the SLC 8X42.

 

[BertL]

I tried to take a picture in my EL 8.5x42 (pre-close focus increase), but it was very hard to get any light to reflect.

I brought out the flashlight… images of EL 8.5x42, EL 8x32, NL 8x32, and CL(B) 8x30…

View attachment 1471907

View attachment 1471908
View attachment 1471910
View attachment 1471911

As you have the old EL 8.5X42, try and compare!!!

 

[Nottabird]

It is human nature to question the veracity of changes made to a well established and trusted product like the EL. But in reference to Paul’s point, I will share my recent experience in regard to the new EL 8.5x42.

I make it a POINT (pun intended) to travel to Cape May several times a year for migrations, trade events and vacations. For years Swarovski was my preferred alpha brand. I own the pocket 8x25 which I take on extended backpacking trips. Love it! I also owned the Habicht 10x40, which I bought “used” at the Bird Observatory around 2016. In 2017 I sent the Habicht to Swarovski for a check and clean. Their service dept. took it upon themselves to “upgrade it” to the latest SLC. The binocular that I received from them was spotless, new housing, new glass…legendary service. But Swarovski’s SLC conversion rendered the quality of view several notches below the view of the Habicht that was mailed to them. I sold that binocular with great remorse.

Back when I bought the Habicht I auditioned a demo EL 10x42; a used by the Park Service for migration counts. That EL was phenomenal glass. It handled better than the Habicht (a brick). It was brighter than the Habicht. And while the Habicht held its own resolving detail, the EL had a perceptible advantage. Contrast and color were close. That 10x42 EL was a fantastic glass!

Fast forward to last week at the Observatory when Brian Moscatello handed me the new EL 8.5 to compare to the Leica Noctivid. I had no idea there was a “new EL’; nor did Brian mention it when he handed the glass to me. So I eyeballed through new EL 8.5. Brian then asked, “what do you think?” My response, “did Swarovski change this glass?” It reminded me of the reworked Habict SLC. That’s the moment I learned that YES, there was a “new EL.”

To be fair, the previous model EL circa 2016 was not available to A/B. And the model I looked through in 2016 was the 10x42, not the 8.5, seven years ago. But the 10x42 EL that I previously demo‘d compared favorably to the Noctivid. To my eyes, the new EL 8.5x42 did not.
Swarovski is discounting the EL for $1,999 as of this writing.

 

[Paultricounty]

Hi Nottabird, I’m assuming you wanted some opinions from me from your message.

It is human nature to question the veracity of changes made to a well established and trusted product like the EL. But in reference to Paul’s point, I will share my recent experience in regard to the new EL 8.5x42.

I make it a POINT (pun intended) to travel to Cape May several times a year for migrations, trade events and vacations. For years Swarovski was my preferred alpha brand. I own the pocket 8x25 which I take on extended backpacking trips. Love it! I also owned the Habicht 10x40, which I bought “used” at the Bird Observatory around 2016. In 2017 I sent the Habicht to Swarovski for a check and clean. Their service dept. took it upon themselves to “upgrade it” to the latest SLC. The binocular that I received from them was spotless, new housing, new glass…legendary service. But Swarovski’s SLC conversion rendered the quality of view several notches below the view of the Habicht that was mailed to them. I sold that binocular with great remorse.

I don’t really get this, or understand what you’re saying here. Are you saying that Swarovski took your Habicht’s in for service and replaced the internals with SLC optics? It’s more likely they swaped out the old Habicht’s optics for new improved Habicht glass and coatings. I might be misunderstanding you so please elaborate in more detail for the dazed and confused among us 😳.

Back when I bought the Habicht I auditioned a demo EL 10x42; a used by the Park Service for migration counts. That EL was phenomenal glass. It handled better than the Habicht (a brick). It was brighter than the Habicht. And while the Habicht held its own resolving detail, the EL had a perceptible advantage. Contrast and color were close. That 10x42 EL was a fantastic glass!

No doubt EL fantastic glass, rated one of the best of the best. It’s difficult to gather anything here from this statement because you don’t supply the specifics on when each model was made, there are variations with constant improvements every few years. If the Habicht was older than the EL that would make sense. But todays Habicht’s are brighter than EL’s. There were changes to the EL‘s , I think in 2012 to the SV model, which much improved in multiple areas. Others with more knowledge of the date and changes to models could offer more accurate information on this . John Robert’s is the Encyclopedia/google of technical data and information when it comes to optics from the manufacturers here on BF.

Fast forward to last week at the Observatory when Brian Moscatello handed me the new EL 8.5 to compare to the Leica Noctivid. I had no idea there was a “new EL’; nor did Brian mention it when he handed the glass to me. So I eyeballed through new EL 8.5. Brian then asked, “what do you think?” My response, “did Swarovski change this glass?” It reminded me of the reworked Habict SLC. That’s the moment I learned that YES, there was a “new EL.”

Absolutely changes were made to the EL that improved it in almost every area, brightness, CA control, excellent edge correction to the very edge (field flatteners we’re used) , as well as improvements to the focuser.

To be fair, the previous model EL circa 2016 was not available to A/B. And the model I looked through in 2016 was the 10x42, not the 8.5, seven years ago. But the 10x42 EL that I previously demo‘d compared favorably to the Noctivid. To my eyes, the new EL 8.5x42 did not.
Swarovski is discounting the EL for $1,999 as of this writing.

Unless you did side by side comparisons I for one don’t give much weight to that , I don’t do memory opinions.

Under $2000 for an EL imo , is a steal.

Paul

 

[Nottabird]

The Habicht that I reference was the roof prism SLC WB, often referred to as “a brick“. Made in Austria. Swarovski ditched my Austrian glass and updated it to “their version of Portuguese glass.“ Sorry for not spelling that out, but I would think a member with your expertise would know the “brick” was the roof, and not the poro. Offered as a cautionary tale for the clean and check submitters.

The demo EL 10x42 was dated to 2016 in my post. Binoculars used by the Conservatory and its volunteers are current year models, and after 5 months of use are sold by Cape May Observatory as demos at a discount. Perhaps the migration counts are something that you haven’t attended, or participated in, or contributed to? Leave the Ipad home, and attend one of these counts. FYI- We are counting species of birds, not binoculars. Memory opinions do count here.

Regarding the NEW EL, my comments dated to 2023, i.e. literally “last week”. I also qualified my opinion “to be fair”, no A /B because the 2016 model was not available to compare to the 2023 model. I mentioned that Staff confirmed that I was holding the ‘New EL.”

Cape May Bird stocks the latest models and they turn over inventory rapidly. The Observatory is a high traffic destination for birders. Cape May is well known as being a premier destination for migration study. In my opinion, its a great place to join the Audubon Conservancy. The Staff at the Observatory has opinions on all the glass they have looked through over many years. More memory opinions, do those count?

As a birding destination, I have never A/B’d Cape May to Cape Hatteras. If I could be at two places at the same time, I would do that for you. Having visited them, I do have opinions on both destinations. Those are also memory based, so I’ll reserve them for now.

The “constant” in my comparisons then and now is the Noctivid. To my eyes, the 2016 EL 10x42 compared favorably to the 10x42 Noctivid. To my eyes, 2023 EL 8.5 did not measure up to either the 8x42 or 10x42 Noctivid. That’s simply my opinion through observation. Hopefully an opinion posted on this Forum doesn’t hurt anyone.

Your Denco Dennis remark is another story. I guess Denco Dennis is an insider joke for “those in the know”, made at someone else's expense? 😂???? As a new member I don’t get it, but apparently neither do you. What I do know is criticizing members BY NAME benefits no one and exposes the critics insecurities.

 

[Gijs van Ginkel]

Nottabird, post 28,
Swarovski does not have a factory in Portugal, Leica has one.
Gijs van Ginkel

 

[Nottabird]

Nottabird, post 28,
Swarovski does not have a factory in Portugal, Leica has one.
Gijs van Ginkel

Nottabird, post 28,
Swarovski does not have a factory in Portugal, Leica has one.
Gijs van Ginke

You are correct. Should have added “their version.of Portugese glass.” That SLC was a step or two below the EL. My replacement housing and glass did not have the same clarity or “pop” As the original.

 

[Rotherbirder]

You are correct. Should have added “their version.of Portugese glass.” That SLC was a step or two below the EL. My replacement housing and glass did not have the clarity or “pop”.

Yes, but what does this mean? The glass used in Leica instruments will be the same no matter what the country of manufacture - Germany or Portugal. I know of no lesser grade of Swarovski glass to which you are hinting; of course, you may know otherwise. On what - precisely - do you base your assertions?

RB

 

[Nottabird]

Gijs.the replacement glass I received back from Swaro also did not seem as bright as the glass I sent for the clean and check. The decision to replace the majority of my Habicht SLC WB was unilateral and made by Swaro’s service dept. The odd thing about it was while the housing being used showed some minor wear, the original glass itself was clear, free of scratches, fungus, abrasions…essentially perfect. As for their decision to essentially replace the Habicht, I get the sense that the imperfect housing “tail” wagged the glass “dog”. They even sent a new carry case to fit the new housing. Legendary service, but not the best outcome. Aside from being “a brick” in terms of its weight, the Habicht was a superb glass. I was able to pick out individual stars on a US flag at 200 yards.

 

[Nottabird]

Rotherbirder,
My understanding is that Leicas top line binos are manufactured in Germany? Portugal makes the “entry level” Trinovid. I own that glass, and it gets much use, but the Trinovid is second tier vs the Noctivid. I have no doubt that Leica could produce a glass equal to the Noctivid in Portugal if they desired to do so. The build quality of their product is superb.

 

[Nottabird]

Rothersbirder,
FYI- recently added to a thread on the Trinovid 8x42.

 

[Nottabird]

Rothersbirder,
There is also a rumor/speculation that Leica may move all lens production to Portugal and only assemble top tier in Germany. Some say that Portugal is currently manufacturing Noctivid and Ultravid glass and sending to Germany. Have u heard this?




As for football, I follow Spurs. And you?

 

[Nottabird]

Rothersbirder,
FYI- recently added to a thread on the Trinovid HD 8x42. I am a birder first and foremost, with a keen interest in binos. So use in the field is important to me.,,Optical quality along with build quality and handling. Once a quality base level of view is achieved, the bino must be a good fit in every sense of the word. One might argue the merits of the Zeiss Conquest resolution vs Trinovid, but in my hands, in the field, I prefer the Leica and cede the last degree of resolution for its its treatment of color and contrast. It is a very comfortable carry and better fits my hands.

 

[Paultricounty]

The Habicht that I reference was the roof prism SLC WB, often referred to as “a brick“. Made in Austria. Swarovski ditched my Austrian glass and updated it to “their version of Portuguese glass.“ Sorry for not spelling that out, but I would think a member with your expertise would know the “brick” was the roof, and not the poro. Offered as a cautionary tale for the clean and check submitters.

My apologies, sometimes I miss something or I read too quickly, I must’ve missed the comment about the brick. I don’t really know anything about Swarovski using Portuguese , or if you mean Leica glass. I was just trying to share some of my experience over the last four or five years and owning a few dozen of the binoculars being discussed here on the daily basis.

The Habicht that I reference was the roof prism SLC WB, often referred to as “a brick“. Made in Austria. Swarovski ditched my Austrian glass and updated it to “their version of Portuguese glass.“ Sorry for not spelling that out, but I would think a member with your expertise would know the “brick” was the roof, and not the poro. Offered as a cautionary tale for the clean and check submitters.

The demo EL 10x42 was dated to 2016 in my post. Binoculars used by the Conservatory and its volunteers are current year models, and after 5 months of use are sold by Cape May Observatory as demos at a discount. Perhaps the migration counts are something that you haven’t attended, or participated in, or contributed to? Leave the Ipad home, and attend one of these counts. FYI- We are counting species of birds, not binoculars. Memory opinions do count here.

This is very true , and I humbly (and without snarkiness ) concede that I spend way too much time on my iPad. I’m more of an equipment guy in my multiple hobbies, binoculars to me are more of an all around observing tool than just for birding, which I’m a beginner.

Regarding the NEW EL, my comments dated to 2023, i.e. literally “last week”. I also qualified my opinion “to be fair”, no A /B because the 2016 model was not available to compare to the 2023 model. I mentioned that Staff confirmed that I was holding the ‘New EL.”

Cape May Bird stocks the latest models and they turn over inventory rapidly. The Observatory is a high traffic destination for birders. Cape May is well known as being a premier destination for migration study. In my opinion, its a great place to join the Audubon Conservancy. The Staff at the Observatory has opinions on all the glass they have looked through over many years. More memory opinions, do those count?

Sounds like a great place. Memories definitely count when somebody in the know has tried out some optics and can give a general feeling of its capabilities and its optical level. Not so much when we compare them to Binoculars years apart.

As a birding destination, I have never A/B’d Cape May to Cape Hatteras. If I could be at two places at the same time, I would do that for you. Having visited them, I do have opinions on both destinations. Those are also memory based, so I’ll reserve them for now.

No need, I can get peoples opinions on multiple destinations on YouTube. Much appreciated that you’re reserve those memories, maybe start another discussion in another sub forum, i’m sure we’ll all jump over there with you 😏.

The “constant” in my comparisons then and now is the Noctivid. To my eyes, the 2016 EL 10x42 compared favorably to the 10x42 Noctivid. To my eyes, 2023 EL 8.5 did not measure up to either the 8x42 or 10x42 Noctivid. That’s simply my opinion through observation. Hopefully an opinion posted on this Forum doesn’t hurt anyone.

I own most of the ones you’re talking about and the ones I don’t anymore i’ve compared extensively side-by-side. My opinion is that the all the EL’s are on a similar optical level as the Noctivids , except for some slight differences in CA correction in the 10’s, your mileage may vary. I’m not hurt by your opinion, there may be others here that are 😜.

Your Denco Dennis remark is another story. I guess Denco Dennis is an insider joke for “those in the know”, made at someone else's expense? 😂???? As a new member I don’t get it, but apparently neither do you. What I do know is criticizing members BY NAME benefits no one and exposes the critics insecurities.

Again sorry I didn’t know that you were so new to the forum you didn’t know some of the long time members MO’s. Dennis and I and a few other members have a tendency to give digs to each other , but it’s mostly for fun and no disrespect is ever intended. Dennis is a wealth of knowledge and I agree with him more times than I care to admit. ✌🏼. Please don’t confuse sarcasm with criticism. I think you’re reading way too much into my insecurities 🙏🏼.

 

[Paultricounty]

Rothersbirder,
There is also a rumor/speculation that Leica may move all lens production to Portugal and only assemble top tier in Germany. Some say that Portugal is currently manufacturing Noctivid and Ultravid glass and sending to Germany. Have u heard this?




As for football, I follow Spurs. And you?

It’s not a rumor it’s public knowledge , Leica moved all their production to Portugal a few years ago.

 

[Nottabird]

Based on the Trinovid 8x42 HD that I own, LEICA has very tight QC in their factory in Portugal. I guess there is still some MADE IN GERMANY STOCK OUT THERE or is LEICA STILL ASSEMBLING in GERMANY?

 

[Nottabird]

Where Leica seems to be cutting corners is in the peripherals/accessories. The Cordora case that is in the box with the Trinovid HD should come with a shoe horn. It offers very little in terms of protection, but it will keep dust off the binocular. I noted that Swarovski also downgraded the case on the NEW EL. The manufacturers will probably tell you that they are putting all the money into the OPTICS. Profit is based on both margin and dollars. When the economy tightens and volume declines, the accountants look to find ways to cut costs, raise margins and generate dollars. I served as VP of Marketing and Sales for several companies, prior to retirement and know that drill very well.