Robins are flycatchers? (1 Viewer)

[Nutcracker]

Hogner, Burgas Riera, Wold, Lifjeld & Johnsen (in press). Intergeneric hybridization between Common Redstart Phoenicurus phoenicurus and Whinchat Saxicola rubetra revealed by molecular analyses. J Ornithol. [abstract & preview]

:eek!: :eek!: :eek!:

Any pics of it anywhere?

Edit: found pics here:
http://www.listafuglestasjon.no/def...MAIN&pxmode=&pxnewsgroup=2&pxnewsid=354&ool=J

 

[Peter Kovalik]

Fiscal Flycatcher

Guinevere O. U. Wogan, Kevin A. Feldheim, Gary Voelker, Rauri C. K. Bowie. Development and characterization of thirteen microsatellite markers for the Fiscal Flycatcher (Sigelus silens) for use in phylogeographic and landscape genetics research. Conservation Genetics Resources March 2015, Volume 7, Issue 1, pp 125-127.

Abstract:
The Fiscal Flycatcher, Sigelus silens, is the only representative of a monotypic genus, endemic to Southern Africa, and may represent two cryptic species. Here we describe the development of thirteen microsatellite markers, and characterize polymorphism for each one. We found that all but one of our 13 loci were highly variable, each having five or more alleles. This suggests that these markers will have high variability across the species range and will be of utility in understanding the extent of gene flow among populations.

 

[Peter Kovalik]

Puvaneswari, A/P Puvanasundram (2012) Phylogeny of selected flycatchers (Family : muscicapidae) inferred from mtDNA cytochrome oxidase I gene. Universiti Malaysia Sarawak

ABSTRACT
The phylogeny of selected flycatchers (Family: Muscicapidae) was inferred from mtDNA cytochrome oxidase I gene through DNA sequencing analysis. Polymerase chain reaction (PCR) method was incorporated in this study which resulted in approximately 498 base pairs (bp) of end product. Phylogenetic tree was constructed by using Neighbor Joining (NJ), Maximum parsimony (MP), Maximum Likelihood (ML) and Bayesian analysis method. Both NJ and MP produced 2 major clades which separated subfamily Muscicapinae from Monarchinae and Rhipidurinae which is debated to have diverged into a new family. ML and Bayesian analysis proved that genus Rhipidura and Terpsiphone are more closely related to each other than to subfamily Muscicapinae. The study indicates that using cytochrome oxidase I gene can resolve the relationship among species well.

 

[Richard Klim]

Palm thrushes

Duncan Wright, 10,000 Birds, 27 May 2015: What is a Palm-thrush?

 

[Richard Klim]

Blackthroat

Alström, Zhao, He & Lei (in press). New locality for the endangered Blackthroat Calliope obscura. J Ornithol. [abstract]

 

[Richard Klim]

Clement & Rose 2015

Clement & Rose 2015. Robins and Chats. Christopher Helm.

The amazon preview includes the table of contents, revealing the scope of coverage and species-level taxonomy.

[See also: Books etc.]

 

[Nutcracker]

Clement & Rose 2015. Robins and Chats. Christopher Helm.

The amazon preview includes the table of contents, revealing the scope of coverage and species-level taxonomy.

[See also: Books etc.]

A paraphyletic group, with the absence of genera like Ficedula.

 

[Richard Klim]

A paraphyletic group, with the absence of genera like Ficedula.

Indeed, but that's been long anticipated.

See Taxonomy and systematics (p19).

(It's a common problem for guides prepared over many years.)

 

[Nutcracker]

Indeed, but that's been long anticipated.

See Taxonomy and systematics (p19).

(It's a common problem for guides prepared over many years.)

I'd thought that this might be new enough to have incorporated the majority of these updates - the new phylogeny is shown on fig. 2 (p. 33), so why isn't it followed??

 

[Richard Klim]

I'd thought that this might be new enough to have incorporated the majority of these updates - the new phylogeny is shown on fig. 2 (p. 33), so why isn't it followed??

Presumably the overall size/scope/design has long been agreed with the publisher, plates and species accounts take many years to research/paint, etc etc...

 

[l_raty]

Besides adding Ficedula, to get a monophyletic scope would require, at first sight:
- adding Monticola (incl. Pseudocossyphus), Myophonus, Vauriella, Heinrichia, Leonardina;
- deleting Sialia, Cochoa, Chlamydochaera, Grandala, as these are thrushes;
- either deleting Cercotrichas, Copsychus, Kittacinchla, Trichixos, as they make up a group that is sister to muscicapine flycatchers, and Namibornis (the only gene that has been sequenced for this bird shows that it is a muscicapine flycatcher), or adding all the other muscicapine flyactchers: Muscicapa, Bradornis, Melaenornis, Myioparus, Fraseria, Empidornis, "Rhinomyias" goodfellowi (which seems totally unrelated to Vauriella; two genes have been sequenced for this species, by two fully independent research groups, both make it a [rather basal] basal muscicapine flycatcher) (generic limits are unclear in this group);
- if the latter option was chosen (and optionally if wasn't), adding all the niltavine flycatcher: Niltava, Cyornis (including the "Rhinomyias" that are actually Cyornis), Cyanoptila, Eumyias, Anthipes (unless already added as "Ficedula");
- if this last option was not chosen, probably also deleting "Brachypteryx" major and albiventris, as based on the three genes that have been sequenced for a host of individuals of these, they consistently appear to be niltavine flycatchers too.

Some of the above may not have been stated in any publication, but all is supported by data that are readily available, I think... Whatever the choice, this would imply a major change in the scope of the book.

 

[Richard Klim]

Besides adding Ficedula, to get a monophyletic scope would require, at first sight:
- adding Monticola (incl. Pseudocossyphus), Myophonus, ...

Monticola and Myophonus were already treated in Clement & Hathway 2000 (Thrushes).

There are similar problems(?) with, eg, Kirwan & Green 2011 (Cotingas and Manakins), Kennerley & Pearson 2010 (Reed and Bush Warblers). It must be frustrating for anyone trying to write a 'family' guide in the midst of today's rapidly evolving taxonomy...

I think we have to take such books as a worthwhile exercise in providing a synthesis of published data for a loosely-defined 'assemblage' of species.

 

[Nutcracker]

Some of the above may not have been stated in any publication, but all is supported by data that are readily available, I think... Whatever the choice, this would imply a major change in the scope of the book.

Yep, I realised it would be a big difference from the traditional 'chats' (Ficedula was just a single example!). But I thought (hoped!) the book would have been recently enough started to follow the new taxonomy right from its inception

 

[l_raty]

Monticola and Myophonus were already treated in Clement & Hathway 2000 (Thrushes).

Yes, but if that counts, then the delineation of the taxonomic groups is lagging by more than 15 years, and must probably be regarded as uncorrectable...
Of course, there might conceivably be a work in progress on "flycatchers and niltavas", that we've not heard about yet, but also started years ago and with an already determined and unchageable scope, that will cover all the groups that have not been covered by either Clements & Hathway, or Clement & Rose?

 

[Richard Klim]

Of course, there might conceivably be a work in progress on "flycatchers and niltavas", that we've not heard about yet, but also started years ago and with an already determined and unchageable scope, that will cover all the groups that have not been covered by either Clements & Hathway, or Clement & Rose?

That would be nice, but Helm Identification Guides are becoming increasingly infrequent, and I suspect that they'll soon be an extinct format.

 

[gusasp]

"Rhinomyias" goodfellowi (which seems totally unrelated to Vauriella; two genes have been sequenced for this species, by two fully independent research groups, both make it a [rather basal] basal muscicapine flycatcher) (generic limits are unclear in this group)

if this last option was not chosen, probably also deleting "Brachypteryx" major and albiventris, as based on the three genes that have been sequenced for a host of individuals of these, they consistently appear to be niltavine flycatchers too.

Both of these are news to me. So major/albiventris are both not at all Myiomela? I've always found that move a bit strange. Laurent, have you've got more info on them and ''goodfellowi''?

 

[l_raty]

Myiomela major / albiventris

Will try to show, but I don't really know more than what the data show.

Myiomela: data for major and albiventris were produced by Robin et al. 2010 [pdf]: cytb, cox1, gapdh and the control region. There is not much to do with the cr, because the locus has not been sequenced for enough species. All three other genes place the two species with niltavines, albeit support with individual genes is not very high. Attached is a tree based on these three genes plus myo. M. leucura is also included, and also Brachypteryx leucophrys, B. montana, and "B." stellata.

 

[l_raty]

Rhinomyias goodfellowi (& Namibornis)

Rag1 -- I have attached a tree: Namibornis (sequence from Beresford et al. 2005 [pdf]) and Rhinomyias goodfellowi (Cibois & Cracraft 2004 [pdf]) are both in Muscicapini. (Support very high.)

Cox1 -- there is a sequence of R. goodfellowi deposited in GenBank in 2013 by Luczon et al., which was part of a barcoding program; I'd perhaps better not distribute an analysis based on it, though, as the work that the sequence cites appears still unpublished and, although public in GenBank, the sequence is still private in BOLD. Anyway, anyone can easily hit "Run BLAST" on the sequence page in GenBank: it places the species in exactly the same position as rag1. (Support is not good with just this gene, though).
There is a second sequence of this species in the BOLD database, which is 99.69% identical, which cannot be seen directly but will appear in the results that the BOLD ID Engine will generate for you if you submit it the GenBank sequence.

 

[Nutcracker]

...

Myiomela: data for major and albiventris were produced by Robin et al. 2010 [pdf]: ....

Very nice nominative determinism . . . a paper about robins written by Dr. Robin :t:

 

[l_raty]

Very nice nominative determinism . . . a paper about robins written by Dr. Robin :t:

He called them shortwings, though