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Why are those dang Habicht's so BRIGHT! (25 Viewers)
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I can easily see the difference, but my eyes are so well trained after having so MANY binoculars. A lot of times you have to side by side them. I got to thinking the Kowa Prominar Genesis 8x32 was pretty good, then I side by sided it with the NL and the NL simply blew it away. In binoculars, like most things, you get what you pay for. Without even side by siding them I can easily tell the difference between a $500, $1000 and $1500 binocular. I can't even tolerate a $500 roof prism anymore. I need at least a $1500 roof like the Meostar to wet my whistle, or a $1000 porro like the Habicht. It is hard to go back to the cheaper binoculars when you get used to the good stuff.
The 95% transmission of the Habicht will surprisingly help you more in the day than aperture will. The cone of light even though it is only 4 mm is brighter, so it seems brighter even in the daytime, and you get the sparkle that I love.
It is funny how porros don't even need ED glass or exotic lens coatings, but have less CA than some roofs. I guess it is in the design.
Paultricounty
Well-known member
I agree with Diries1, there are better roof prism choices out there than the old style porro Habicht’s. Even though they are very nice , they are throwbacks and have limitations as Tenex described. I still like them for there retro old style with nice optics.
The thing about as Dries indicated of other choices , Viraj has a Swaro NL, so that’s where i don’t get it. He’s already got the best, if not, one of the best. 🤔
The thing about as Dries indicated of other choices , Viraj has a Swaro NL, so that’s where i don’t get it. He’s already got the best, if not, one of the best. 🤔
tenex
reality-based
So I'm not the only one here wondering why. If you're dissatisfied with arguably the best bin ever made, it's important to figure out exactly what it is you dislike. When you compare it to a Habicht, at least two differences are in play: flat field vs traditional curved field, and roof vs porro (stereopsis). Which one is your problem, or is it both? That will determine your solution.
I think he/she told that here :l
dorubird
The unskilled mechanic blames his tools!
Every time I hear about his great light transmission, I always remember his big problems. To me Habicht 8x30 is a scientific curiosity with his 96% light transmission. It is not a binocular with balanced specifications. He has personality, it is not for everyone!
Paultricounty
Well-known member
As the years and decades go by, I realize more and more that people pick up on optic idiosyncrasies very much differently from one to another, than I previously had thought. The term, it’s not for everyone, applies to every binocular I believe in all the discussions in the Binoculars sub group of BF. And that goes for the best of the best. The Swarovski EL’s were considered the best birding binoculars not long ago, but the best has problems, (to some) globe effect, to flat of a field. And I can make statements like that for probably every set of bins available.
Small list (I seem to have to much time on my hands this morning), to much glare, FOV to flat, FOV to much distortion (curvature), not sharp enough , to sharp (one reviewer on Noctivids 🤪), to green, to yellow, to bright, not bright enough, focuser to slow, focuser to fast, focuser to heavy, focuser to light. OK I’ll stop there, but you get it I’m sure.
So for some people, that 96% light transmission jumps right out at them, and others not so much. For me they work, if I want to observe something at night, I can use my 742 Habicht’s and the street lights will illuminate the whole block, can’t do that with my NL’s. And yes , I get the exit pupal thing, but even my 742 UVHD+ don’t have that ability. Do I prefer the Swaro over the Leica during the day, no. The Ultravids are an extremely balanced optic, the Habicht’s (as you suggested) not so much. But definitely has personality 😄
Paul
Kind of like Jane Mansfield.
Even the best don't work for everybody. The NL 8x42 didn't work for me.
No binocular is perfect for everybody. For me, the NL 8x42 was a "Glare Monster."Habicht must be "punished"every time showing his weaknesses, because it's like a very good wine in which you pour vinegar!!!
It took so long for me to realize why I don't like the view of NL 8x42. Maybe I need more time 😋 I think the hudge flat field and lack of stereoscopic view is the problem. Don't misunderstand that I don't like to have a big FOV in binoculars. Similarly, I like to have the flat field in binoculars with a small FOV. The problem is I can't concentrate on a small objective in the middle of the FOV of a big flat field. I feel the object in the middle of the FOV is highlighted in binoculars with field curvature. Additionally, I feel the view is restricted in roofs. I just see what I see, like I am observing a photo. However, porros allow me to change the focus of my eyes inside the view of binoculars. Maybe I am the only one experiencing that. I might like NL x10 because of the less TFOV and less DOF compared to x8.
Paultricounty
Well-known member
You won’t like the 10NL either, incredible field of view for a 10 X. And you should want DOF, that’s a good thing. I think you would really like the Leica Ultravid 7x42 and/or 8x42. The 842 has a relatively small (389 ft @ 1000yrds) and nice curved FOV. Sounds almost like what you’re describing that you would like.
The classic, known as the retro here in 7x35 is also amazingly intoxicating bino, of course just in my opinion (and others😏).
Paul
tenex
reality-based
I don't quite get the roof vs Porro thing, and you haven't mentioned specific (birding?) applications which often determine such choices, but aesthetically you seem to want two things at once: a generous AFOV, but not distracting from the central target, which you want emphasized in some way. That's a good description of a traditional 10x glass (not NL!), with some field curvature and more limited DOF. It's getting hard to avoid field flatteners these days, so if you want current production I would try a 10x Leica (or Meopta?) in your choice of 32/42/50mm, or SLC 10x56 or HT 10x54 with AK prisms which might even remind you of Porros, as they do me. There's also 10x42 SLC which can be bought either used or as Kahles Helia S now, or in Porros, 10x35 E2 or 10x40 Habicht (with all the above caveats).
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Thank you for the suggestion @Paultricounty. That was my original plan to buy a UV 7x42 and NL 10x42. But ended up buying NL 8x42. The shop owner also suggested me to go for an NV instead of an NL. As you mentioned UV would be a much better choice for me. Retrovid 7x35 also seems very interesting except it lacks waterproofness.
I thought the shallow DOF in x10 would allow me to better isolation of the object from the background.
Exactly that is what I mentioned. Normally I do birding in woodlands. I have difficulties separating birds from the background with NL. I think NL would better suit me for birding in open areas, scanning landscapes, and for the night sky.
I will not buy bulky AKs. Then UV, Kahles Helia S, or Habicht are the remaining choices. However, Habicht will have more 3D than Kahles Helia S and I think both have slow focusers. Recently, I bought an old Habicht 10x40, and I liked the viewing comfort of it. As an old model it has a smooth focuser but a yellow tint. And the focuser has an issue. I ordered a new Habicht 10x40 W GA and it is on the way.
Binocollector
Well-known member
I think the Helia S also has AK-prisms. At least the "bow-legged" body form indicates that it has them.
Not all AK-equipped binos are bulky. One of my most comfy to use binos is my DDoptics 10x45 with AK-prisms. A pic -- from left to right: Svbony 10x50 (SP), DDoptics 10x45 (AK), DDoptics 10x50 (SP), Fujinon 10x42, DDoptics 10x42.
