Let's talk PORROS! (1 Viewer)

[Paskman]

It's very sad, I have always considered myself European, as well as British, and I always will👍

 

[Conndomat]

It's very sad, I have always considered myself European, as well as British, and I always will👍

Yes, I also find it very sad too that the British "left" europe, hopefully you will come back soon!
But we should leave this topic for now, otherwise there will be trouble ...

Andreas

 

[Sancho]

I'm wrong about Breaking Bad. I'm bingeing tonight, and in the episode where Walt is finally trying to 'off' Gus, he is using a little pair of silver coloured double hinged compact roofs... With Ruby Coatings!!! And Tyrus was using a little monocular that looked like it was IS, to watch Hector coming out of thd DEA office!

 

[[email protected]]

I'm wrong about Breaking Bad. I'm bingeing tonight, and in the episode where Walt is finally trying to 'off' Gus, he is using a little pair of silver coloured double hinged compact roofs... With Ruby Coatings!!! And Tyrus was using a little monocular that looked like it was IS, to watch Hector coming out of thd DEA office!

Breaking Bad was a fantastic series. My wife and I watched every episode on Netflix. Walt just kept getting deeper and deeper didn't he? Pretty soon there was no getting out of the drug business which is probably true of most drug dealers and manufacturers.

 

[sidpost]

Dennis, I don't know how it is in the USA but here in Germany the internet is full of habicht, not a trace of lack.
I don't see the binoculars threatened with extinction.
No need to rush...

Andreas

When I looked, I had to go to Europe or special order from a dealer as they weren't in stock in the USA at the time.

 

[[email protected]]

When I looked, I had to go to Europe or special order from a dealer as they weren't in stock in the USA at the time.

I found this dealer in Germany who actually stocks many of the Habichts. He has excellent service and fast shipping.

Teleskop-Express: -TS Zubehör

www.teleskop-express.de

 

[PeterPS]

I think it's odd that in 'popular culture' on TV, cinema etc., Binoculars are nearly always porros. (Unless it's futuristic, like with electronic robo-binos). I'm rewatching 'Breaking Bad' and every time anyone produces binos, they're porros. I can't remember any film or TV show with characters using modern roofs. (Yes I'm a rank amateur but nerdy enough to check all binos I see on TV).

Hi Sancho,
Here is a movie with plenty of roofs:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Big_Year
Cheers, Peter

 

[John A Roberts]

And a more revealing shot . . .


John

 

[PeterPS]

And a more revealing shot . . .


John

Swaro SV, Zeiss FL and Kowa BD

 

[Sancho]

There are actually quite a few dealers in Germany that sell Habichts. I've bought four over the years, but never hung onto them. What I would really love, though, is a pair of the very limited edition 8x30 centre-focus, rubber-armoured Habichts that briefly appeared years ago, apparently surplus from an order for a Gulf State security outfit, at a small optics dealer in a little room in an office block in Beijing. (There was a thread all about this but I can't find it.) I was there a little later visiting in-laws, and went to see 'the guy'. He had a bizarre collection of high-end optics for sale, including many Habichts, but not the Green 8x30. He did say he could get them within a few days, but I was leaving for Hunan and never followed up. It was all very Breaking Bad, and he really had the Good Stuff. 96.7% pure..

 

[Conndomat]

I found this dealer in Germany who actually stocks many of the Habichts. He has excellent service and fast shipping.

Teleskop-Express: -TS Zubehör

www.teleskop-express.de

Dennis I would not recommend the dealer for brand binoculars unreservedly!
The service is good, the shipping time too, but if you don't want to burn unnecessary money there are significantly cheaper offers, especially for the higher-priced binoculars!
Astro dealers tend to have higher prices for alpha binoculars; there are many photo dealers in Germany who sell Swarovski Habicht at lower prices.

Teleskop-Express: Swarovski Habicht 10x40 W GA - voll gummiarmiertes Porroprismenglas-Habicht10x40WGA

Die traditionelle Form des Beobachtens: klassische Konstruktion für höchste Beanspruchung in Kombination mit großem Sehfeld. Die Gummiarmierung verbessert Griffigkeit und Stoßfestigkeit.

www.teleskop-express.de

Swarovski HABICHT10X40 W GA inkl.Tasche

<p> </p> <h2><span>TRADITIONSBEWUSST</span></h2> <p>Die traditionelle Form des Beobachtens: Das klassische optische System der Habicht Ferngläser hat sich seit Generationen bewährt und wurde kontinuierlich weiterentwickelt. Dank des Leich

shop.fotosiegl.de

Over 200, - Euro difference, who of course has enough money doesn't have to worry about that.

Andreas

 

[Patudo]

I emailed Markus at APM in Germany about bringing out a line of birding size Porros and this was his response. So lets all order the APM 6x30 binocular and maybe Markus will do a run of 500 APM APO 8x42 Porros for us birders.

"To get a good price we must order minimum 500 pc per model and do a big pre-investment. The 6 x 30 which comes out hopefully soon for sale took almost 1.5 years, way to long. Let's see what success it has, I feel if it is successful, I will consider making other models."

Mit Freundlichen Grüßen / Best Regards
Markus Ludes
CEO

Probably the most genuinely informative post from this poster on this thread. If some of the threads discussing Nikon SE serial numbers are anything to go by, 500 units of a porro in that class may be harder to shift than one might think, partly because a good many birders already own pretty decent 8x42s or 8x32s, and also because a new product won't have the perception of the Nikon SE to help with sales. Anything other than 8x42/40 or 8x32/30 (except possibly 10x42) will be somewhat specialist in application - thus even less demand.

Whenever porros get discussed the statement that a porro offering alpha-class performance could be made for half the price comes up. I'm not so sure that is true, because to match current alphas not just optically, but in waterproofing etc. will increase the price. The old Zeiss 7x50B/GA was not an inexpensive binocular and neither were the Zeiss Nobilems or Oberkochen models Hermann mentions (I recall seeing somewhere that the 8x30B Oberkochen cost more than the comparable 8x30B Dialyt roof).

It could well be there is a better chance of shifting 500 units of PRC-made (APM) porros that offer Monarch HG/Conquest HD class performance at two-thirds to three quarters the price, than 500 that offer alpha performance at a comparable discount. A copy/derivative of the second Oberkochen 8x30B variant, maybe upsized slightly to 8x32, with good build quality and the best coatings Kunming or whoever can offer, could be pretty interesting...

 

[Jessie-66]

Also a porro:

Russische Armee-Entfernungsmesser em-61. ca. 1960-1970. selten | eBay

Finden Sie Top-Angebote für Russische Armee-Entfernungsmesser em-61. ca. 1960-1970. selten bei eBay. Kostenlose Lieferung für viele Artikel!

www.ebay.de

Because wide adjustable stereo base (better parallax) I would like to have a look.
(Stereo base is a technical term used in audio technology.)

Dennis, this could be your new alpha animal. You also could easily determine the distance of the bird or the girl.

Addendum:
https://www.ebay.de/itm/WWII-Russis...360357?hash=item1cfcccbca5:g:ioAAAOSwhtpf5LOk

And here you will find the right headgear:

original Vintage sowjetische russische Armee Stahlhelm SSh-40 WWII | eBay

Finden Sie Top-Angebote für original Vintage sowjetische russische Armee Stahlhelm SSh-40 WWII bei eBay. Kostenlose Lieferung für viele Artikel!

www.ebay.de

 

[[email protected]]

There are actually quite a few dealers in Germany that sell Habichts. I've bought four over the years, but never hung onto them. What I would really love, though, is a pair of the very limited edition 8x30 centre-focus, rubber-armoured Habichts that briefly appeared years ago, apparently surplus from an order for a Gulf State security outfit, at a small optics dealer in a little room in an office block in Beijing. (There was a thread all about this, but I can't find it.) I was there a little later visiting in-laws, and went to see 'the guy'. He had a bizarre collection of high-end optics for sale, including many Habichts, but not the Green 8x30. He did say he could get them within a few days, but I was leaving for Hunan and never followed up. It was all very Breaking Bad, and he really had the Good Stuff. 96.7% pure..

Didn't somebody get Henry a pair of the green Habichts 8x30 GA a while back? I remember reading something about it on Bird Forum. I don't think he liked them. Maybe he would sell them to you.

 

[[email protected]]

Dennis I would not recommend the dealer for brand binoculars unreservedly!
The service is good, the shipping time too, but if you don't want to burn unnecessary money there are significantly cheaper offers, especially for the higher-priced binoculars!
Astro dealers tend to have higher prices for alpha binoculars; there are many photo dealers in Germany who sell Swarovski Habicht at lower prices.

Teleskop-Express: Swarovski Habicht 10x40 W GA - voll gummiarmiertes Porroprismenglas-Habicht10x40WGA

Die traditionelle Form des Beobachtens: klassische Konstruktion für höchste Beanspruchung in Kombination mit großem Sehfeld. Die Gummiarmierung verbessert Griffigkeit und Stoßfestigkeit.

www.teleskop-express.de

Swarovski HABICHT10X40 W GA inkl.Tasche

<p> </p> <h2><span>TRADITIONSBEWUSST</span></h2> <p>Die traditionelle Form des Beobachtens: Das klassische optische System der Habicht Ferngläser hat sich seit Generationen bewährt und wurde kontinuierlich weiterentwickelt. Dank des Leich

shop.fotosiegl.de

Over 200, - Euro difference, who of course has enough money doesn't have to worry about that.

Andreas

That is a good price on the Habicht 10x40 GA, and they have them in stock. I looked around a lot when I was interested in buying the Habicht 10x40 GA and that was the only dealer I could find that actually had them on the shelf. A lot of the dealers don't have them in stock and get them drop shipped from Swarovski which takes several days to a week.

 

[[email protected]]

Probably the most genuinely informative post from this poster on this thread. If some of the threads discussing Nikon SE serial numbers are anything to go by, 500 units of a porro in that class may be harder to shift than one might think, partly because a good many birders already own pretty decent 8x42s or 8x32s, and also because a new product won't have the perception of the Nikon SE to help with sales. Anything other than 8x42/40 or 8x32/30 (except possibly 10x42) will be somewhat specialist in application - thus even less demand.

Whenever porros get discussed the statement that a porro offering alpha-class performance could be made for half the price comes up. I'm not so sure that is true, because to match current alphas not just optically, but in waterproofing etc. will increase the price. The old Zeiss 7x50B/GA was not an inexpensive binocular and neither were the Zeiss Nobilems or Oberkochen models Hermann mentions (I recall seeing somewhere that the 8x30B Oberkochen cost more than the comparable 8x30B Dialyt roof).

It could well be there is a better chance of shifting 500 units of PRC-made (APM) porros that offer Monarch HG/Conquest HD class performance at two-thirds to three quarters the price, than 500 that offer alpha performance at a comparable discount. A copy/derivative of the second Oberkochen 8x30B variant, maybe upsized slightly to 8x32, with good build quality and the best coatings Kunming or whoever can offer, could be pretty interesting...

The APM APO porro 7x50 I bought from Markus is waterproof and sealed, but it is IF which is easier to waterproof but the little APM 6x30 porro he is going to offer is waterproof and CF and is less than $200, and it looks nice, and he has one and said he likes it a lot, so I think that APM could very well do a waterproof 8x42 APO Porro that could compete with the alpha roofs for $500. Markus has to at least do a run of 500 of them, so he probably has to invest at least $100K and if they don't sell he could be out a lot of money. If we get all the birders on Bird Forum to pre-order the APM 6x30 or buy it when it comes out at the end of February and if he gets some pre-orders on a run of APM APO 8x42 he might risk it. I am really impressed with the APM APO 7x50 porro I bought because the build quality and optics are exceptional. It has hardly NO CA! I would bet the new APM 6x30 porro will compare at least if not better to the Nikon HG 8x30 in quality of view. I think there was mention of an APM APO 8x30 also that was on the drawing board.

APM 8x30 ED and 6x30 Porro Binoculars (Prototypes) - Binoculars - Cloudy Nights

Page 1 of 3 - APM 8x30 ED and 6x30 Porro Binoculars (Prototypes) - posted in Binoculars: On September 22, 2108, Markus Ludes had announced two new small porro binoculars. Originally planned as individual focus instruments, further work and some discussions on the CN forum have now led to a...

www.cloudynights.com

 

[pbjosh]

The APM APO porro 7x50 I bought from Markus is waterproof and sealed, but it is IF which is easier to waterproof but the little APM 6x30 porro he is going to offer is waterproof and CF and is less than $200, and it looks nice, and he has one and said he likes it a lot, so I think that APM could very well do a waterproof 8x42 APO Porro that could compete with the alpha roofs for $500. Markus has to at least do a run of 500 of them, so he probably has to invest at least $100K and if they don't sell he could be out a lot of money. If we get all the birders on Bird Forum to pre-order the APM 6x30 or buy it when it comes out at the end of February and if he gets some pre-orders on a run of APM APO 8x42 he might risk it. I am really impressed with the APM APO 7x50 porro I bought because the build quality and optics are exceptional. It has hardly NO CA! I would bet the new APM 6x30 porro will compare at least if not better to the Nikon HG 8x30 in quality of view. I think there was mention of an APM APO 8x30 also that was on the drawing board.

APM 8x30 ED and 6x30 Porro Binoculars (Prototypes) - Binoculars - Cloudy Nights

Page 1 of 3 - APM 8x30 ED and 6x30 Porro Binoculars (Prototypes) - posted in Binoculars: On September 22, 2108, Markus Ludes had announced two new small porro binoculars. Originally planned as individual focus instruments, further work and some discussions on the CN forum have now led to a...

www.cloudynights.com

Interesting, last time I looked in detail at the APM website, the 8x30 was slated to come along together with the 6x30, but perhaps plans have changed. I just contacted Markus about the 6x30 and he said it's still 1-3 months out. I'm very interested in one and will order as soon as they're available.

I really would like a wide field, good ergonomics, good quality, reasonably compact 6x for use from small boats and from trains and the like. I thought the Kowa 6,5x32 looked to be just the solution. However, despite the fact that I initially liked it quite a bit, over time I like it ever less - it is just not an easy view for me, I really have to center my eyes in the exit pupils to get a good image, which defeats the advantage of large exit pupils. The difficult to define "focus snap" is not that great, and at times I feel that I need to adjust the diopter at different focus distances. My copy appears to be quite well collimated but there's still something about it: either focus or aberration related, I'm not expert enough to say with any confidence, and will avoid any further speculation. But the result is that it is not terribly comfortable or enjoyable for prolonged use, even if the actual view is hard to fault for the price.

On the subject of an 8x42 birding porro - I think it would be a challenge to sell 500 units at almost any price. I certainly don't have any interest. I have a handful of excellent 30-42mm roof prism bins that I use for birding. If there were a better compact 6x roof prism bin than the Kowa I would probably have it. If my Kowa 6,5x32 were more pleasing to use, I wouldn't have much interest in the APM. My interest in the APM is for a good 6x30 with a good FOV more than interest in a porro. Admittedly, I'm absolutely not a porro fanatic, but I have nothing against them either. I just want good birding binoculars and the vast majority of them are roof models.

 

[PYRTLE]

Opticron used to market a range of porros - the SR GA which included a 12.5 x 50 and a 9-22 × 50. The last survivor is a cute little 8 x 32. I think also a 7 x 50 was around for a while. They developed from the HR WP range. I can't find an old brochure page at the moment.

Nikon 7 x 35 Action EX is described as waterproof..... a lovely affordable porro unit.

 

[[email protected]]

Interesting, last time I looked in detail at the APM website, the 8x30 was slated to come along together with the 6x30, but perhaps plans have changed. I just contacted Markus about the 6x30 and he said it's still 1-3 months out. I'm very interested in one and will order as soon as they're available.

I really would like a wide field, good ergonomics, good quality, reasonably compact 6x for use from small boats and from trains and the like. I thought the Kowa 6,5x32 looked to be just the solution. However, despite the fact that I initially liked it quite a bit, over time I like it ever less - it is just not an easy view for me, I really have to center my eyes in the exit pupils to get a good image, which defeats the advantage of large exit pupils. The difficult to define "focus snap" is not that great, and at times I feel that I need to adjust the diopter at different focus distances. My copy appears to be quite well collimated but there's still something about it: either focus or aberration related, I'm not expert enough to say with any confidence, and will avoid any further speculation. But the result is that it is not terribly comfortable or enjoyable for prolonged use, even if the actual view is hard to fault for the price.

On the subject of an 8x42 birding porro - I think it would be a challenge to sell 500 units at almost any price. I certainly don't have any interest. I have a handful of excellent 30-42mm roof prism bins that I use for birding. If there were a better compact 6x roof prism bin than the Kowa I would probably have it. If my Kowa 6,5x32 were more pleasing to use, I wouldn't have much interest in the APM. My interest in the APM is for a good 6x30 with a good FOV more than interest in a porro. Admittedly, I'm absolutely not a porro fanatic, but I have nothing against them either. I just want good birding binoculars and the vast majority of them are roof models.

Ditto on the Kowa 6.5x32. There was just something about it that never did it for me. Like you said there were some aberrations that bothered me which is due to the fact that it is a lower end roof. A Porro doesn't have these aberrations. You wouldn't have any interest in an APO APM 8x42 Porro that would compare with a $2K roof? Have you ever looked through a big Porro? They will blow you away if you are used to those little roof prism 8x32 birding binoculars. They did me. Don't you notice the 3D view when you look through a Porro or the lack of aberrations or the brightness? It amazes me that people don't notice the difference in the view between a porro and a roof. I guess the marketing companies have done their jobs well and convinced people to buy roofs with an inferior view at 3 times the cost. If APM made a good quality APO Porro in a 8x42 it would be at the top of the list on Allbinos under the 8x42 category just like Porros top the lists of the 7x50, 10x50 and 8x56 categories at 1/3 the cost. A Porro is a superior design and has just lost sales because people like the looks and size of the roofs and the manufacturers make more profit on them.

 

[[email protected]]

Opticron used to market a range of porros - the SR GA which included a 12.5 x 50 and a 9-22 × 50. The last survivor is a cute little 8 x 32. I think also a 7 x 50 was around for a while. They developed from the HR WP range. I can't find an old brochure page at the moment.

Nikon 7 x 35 Action EX is described as waterproof..... a lovely affordable porro unit.

The Nikon 7x35 Action EX is a good little Porro binocular. It is a great bargain for the price.